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Musings About Animations

Mick

Mick

SOH-CM-2025
Just wondering - can anyone recall an FS9 model where something like drop tanks or an ejected pilot could be dropped or shot from a plane and not go just so far, then follow along behind and below the plane for the rest of the flight?

I remember an Italian jet (maybe an MB-326 or 339???) where you could have the pilot eject, and there was David's T4M Torpedo Truck that would drop the torpedo, but in both of those the dropped or ejected item would tag along behind the plane on an invisible tether.

Has there been an FS9 model that would drop something and it would really go away and stay gone? Not just disappear with the click of a button, but visibly drop away, fall behind, and stay gone, not follow along?
 
I think my Bear Studio's Mig 17 has the pilot eject when you pull the handle in the cockpit, the Mig would then spin out of control and the pilot would flash away into the distance, im guessing thats not quite what your after. I dont have it installed in 9 at the moment so i cant check
 
ian elliot said:
I think my Bear Studio's Mig 17 has the pilot eject when you pull the handle in the cockpit, the Mig would then spin out of control and the pilot would flash away into the distance, im guessing thats not quite what your after. I dont have it installed in 9 at the moment so i cant check
Click to expand...

I haven't heard about that one. It's sort of the same thing.

The RB-45C often (perhaps regularly) used water-alcohol injection for extra takeoff thrust. The fluid was carried in tanks on the under-nacelle hard points in drop tanks that look like the ones North American used on the P-51 and F-86, but much bigger.

The idea is to have them on the RB when it appears in the sim, the alcohol-water kicks in when you take off, leaving heavy smoke trails, and when the tanks are dry the tanks drop away and fall away, and they stay away, not following along behind you like with the models I remembered with an ejectable pilot and our T4M with the dropable torpedo.

I didn't think that had been done before, at least for FS9 or any earlier version of MSFS.

Anyway, David has figured it out and when the tanks drop off of the RB-45 they will stay dropped and not follow you throughout your flight. I was curious about whether this is an FS first.
 
With FS you can't use animations to scale vertex/mesh size. This means the only way to hide things that drop is to move them far way from the aircraft and hope the player doesn't see them or put the inside the aircraft after they have fallen away so they are not seen by the player.
 
Allen said:
With FS you can't use animations to scale vertex/mesh size. This means the only way to hide things that drop is to move them far way from the aircraft and hope the player doesn't see them or put the inside the aircraft after they have fallen away so they are not seen by the player.
Click to expand...

That's what I thought, but David has found a way to make the tanks disappear after they fall away. I have no idea how he did it. That kind of thing is far beyond my ken. Maybe they're still there but become invisible??? All I know is that they can be seen to drop away (not just disappear) but if you look back for them you don't see them.
 
My flabber has never been so gasted Mick! :dejection:

Have you not flown my A6M2-K Trainer, Curtis Shrike, Arado 234A, Ki-27 Nate or the Northrop BT-1 (in someones top or three Golden-age wish list ac?!)...where do you think the bombs, rocket packs and drop tanks go?

Ha ha ha...just pulling your leg. Yes, I did those animations with the 'dropped' items 'disappearing'. As Allen says, they are actually so far away, some 10000ft both behind and below the ac that they are totally out of render or view distance of the simmer.

You can animate them with either a moving animation ie they slowly drop off or eject out, then fall away (or instantly which I've done with some of my models), where each animation frame is a movement/distance in space. Or with a command such as a light on/off command (which Alphasim have used with their older models such as their Hawker Typhoon), which makes them disappear/appear.

Cheers

Shessi
 
Shessi said:
My flabber has never been so gasted Mick! :dejection:

Have you not flown my A6M2-K Trainer, Curtis Shrike, Arado 234A, Ki-27 Nate or the Northrop BT-1 (in someones top or three Golden-age wish list ac?!)...where do you think the bombs, rocket packs and drop tanks go?

Ha ha ha...just pulling your leg. Yes, I did those animations with the 'dropped' items 'disappearing'. As Allen says, they are actually so far away, some 10000ft both behind and below the ac that they are totally out of render or view distance of the simmer.

You can animate them with either a moving animation ie they slowly drop off or eject out, then fall away (or instantly which I've done with some of my models), where each animation frame is a movement/distance in space. Or with a command such as a light on/off command (which Alphasim have used with their older models such as their Hawker Typhoon), which makes them disappear/appear.

Cheers

Shessi
Click to expand...

Well, what's different is that you don't make them drop by clicking a button or keying a key. The only way make them disappear is by activating the system before you take off, and the only way you can make them reappear is to land, taxi to the ramp and shut down the engines. Then the invisible and very fast-working ground crew run out and reinstall the tanks and run off before you get out of the plane, all so fast that you can't even see them, leaving the tanks on and ready the next flight.

If you don't set it up before you take off you're stuck with the tanks for the entire flight, you can't drop them any other way.

System activation is done through the autopilot before takeoff, and there's something in the panel too. Once it's activated, all you do is take off and when you reach the time and altitude where the tanks are empty they drop away with no action on your part. Once they drop they stay gone. I guess if you turned your viewpoint and watched and followed them down at some point they'd disappear, if you didn't crash first from not looking where you're going at low altitude. I can't say that they drop all the way to the ground but like Elvis, they leave the building. I have no understanding of how it works technically, but the operation is different from how it works on those other models. Back when David made the T4M he did it that other way with the torpedo.

The method is definitely new. It's not an FS animation in the usual sense. And as far as I can tell the result is new. I tried it on David's test mule (not yet in the finished model) and I saw the tanks drop away, and I couldn't spot them behind me like I could with the T4M torpedo.

Maybe it's magic. Or maybe it just seems that way to me because David is smarter than I am. You probably remember Arthur C. Clarke's comment that any technology so advanced than you can't understand it seems like magic.
 
Ahhhh I beg your pardon Mick, I didn't digest exactly what you described.. :teapot:

Yes nice, clever. He may be using a gauge that's linked to engine revs/thrust, so when you go max power/TO and power/activated the gauge, the gauge 'timer' starts the animation, and only at the end of the ani does it 'drop' the tanks. Again when you shut down, and the revs/thrust drops to 0 and the gauge re-attaches the tanks.

Would be interesting to look into that gauge/ani combo, might be useful in otherways/ac.

Which model is it, as I have the fs9 model his with your tex from Simviation, and there's nothing visual or mentioned about drop tanks? Or is it something new he's done?

Cheers

Shessi
 
The model hasn't been released yet. There are still a few items to be finished, some panel work (like the RB panel that's not even started yet,) and a few little model corrections, and a manual only half written, and David's been tweaking this feature further. When I tested it yesterday on a copy of his test mule the water-alcohol tanks reappeared on the plane when the plane came to a full stop on the parking ramp ready for the next flight. That seemed awkward, as they would reappear any time our annoying fellow aviator Capt. A. I. Pilot would cut you off on a taxiway and make you slam on the brakes.

So David modified the system so that the tanks reappeared when the engines were shut down. But when I tried that this morning I found that some digital wires much have been crossed because the tanks would disappear as soon as the first engine started, and they would only come back when the engines were shut down again. David's working on that as I type.

Yesterday I thought it worked through the autopilot, but David informed me that it's completely automatic and he'd only told me to use the autopilot so I wouldn't get distracted and collide with the ground while watching the tanks. I also said that it involved something in the panel because a separate panel was required, but that turned out not to be so. It's all a mystery to me.

When David gets it all worked out and set up you can try it. I'm sure he wouldn't mind of I sent you a copy of the test mule once it's set up in final form. But I can't explain how it works. That under the hood (should I say "bonnet") stuff is Greek to me and I haven't a clue. David tries to explain it to me but I don't understand it. I just know that it's not the same as the way it's been done of previous models, where a button separates the item and another click brings it back, and meanwhile it follows along below and behind.

He'll probably be glad to explain it to you once he's got it all set up and working right.

Despite the remaining things to be done, I think we're on the home stretch ad it won't be long before we can release the package.
 
Correction: Yesterday it was set to remount the tanks when airspeed reached zero. That's why it would be awkward to have them reappear if you had to slam on the brakes to avoid a careening AI plane.

Engines off seemed like a better way. Unfortunately, it came out as a toggle, so the plane appeared in the sim with the tanks on, but they disappeared when you started the engines and the only way to get them back was to shut them down again.

I'm sure David will sort it out.
 
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